RE: Torsen tech

[QSHIPQ@aol.com]

Dave and Orin:
"Above" the Bias Ratio rear, only requires that actual spin up of the tires 
happens before torque shift.  What is *only* relevent is whatever the BR or 
BR+ (= BR + axle speed differences) condition translates to in terms of 
chassis dynamics.  All we really need to do is plot out the torque conditions 
vs relative slip angles, that gives us a chassis dynamic.  Axle speed 
differences only affect (delay) the introduction of the traction variable.  
It's still a torque allocation of 75r/25f per Dave E's posts.

If what Dave says is true, that above the BR, the torsen allocates torque 
based on the max BR but allows axle speed differences, then all that really 
means is that the rear wheels *have* to physically spin to get torque shift.  
And if 75/25 is oversteer, that doesn't change with axle speed differences.  
It's only relevent to when the torque shift forward is going to occur.  So, 
in summary, within the torque bias ratio, one can argue torque shift *can* 
occur without wheel spin.  Outside the torque bias ratio a tire needs to spin 
before torque shift *can* occur.  Accomodating axle speed differences doesn't 
change the chassis dynamic of U or O.  I might argue, that the bite with axle 
speed differences is going to be harder than the bite within the TBR.  Why?  
Cuz if you look at torque transfer as an elastic band, and you stretched the 
TBR to accomodate axle speed differences, when your torque allocation goes to 
the front, it has a higher potential of being at the BR.

We only need to address at what BR O or U prevails.  I think Orin put it 
best, if you have acceleration, you must have torque, you have torque, the 
torsen will allocate it.  I argue, if you have acceleration and a turn, you 
have torsen torque allocation, if you have torsen allocation and a turn you 
have relative slip angles, if you have relative slip angles, you have O or U. 
 Axle speed differences aren't really relevent to the discussion.  We could 
easily modify my statement to say at the bias ratio rear, <or above causing 
axle speed differences>, the chassis dynamic is still O.  Per Dave's 
explanation of a torsen exceeding it's bias ratio, allows relative axle speed 
differences while allocating torque at the BR.

HTH

Scott Justusson