[200q20v] Upgraded Brakes

Phil Rose pjrose at frontiernet.net
Sat Jan 19 13:46:00 EST 2002

In case anyone feels the G60 brakes are acceptable for street use,
yet thinks they will be completely unsuitable for the track, here's a
recap of my recent experience which, IMHO, helped to breathe some
life into the much-maligned G60 brakes.

Early last year I had serious intentions to do a BIRA upgrade (my car
has G60 brakes/oem rotors). But I procratinated (as usual), and I
didn't procure suitable 16 or 17" wheels in time. So as the Watkins
Glen event approached (last August), it was obvious that I would be
stuck with using my old G60 brakes (the oem rotors were almost new).

That was a pretty bleak prospect for me, considering that during the
previous year's WG event--my first-- I had trashed my rotors --
burning completely through the oem pads while barely into my second
day on the track. That event was a live-and-learn experience,
teaching me to be more observant and conservative about brakes at
track events. So...what to do, now that WG was fast approaching? To
make matters worse--the car would be shared with my son, who would be
attending his first event.

On the strong recommendation of Art Mayhew, I ordered a set of Hawk
Blue (9012) brake pads for the G60s. Art advised me that these would
be suitable _only_ for track use since, if used for street driving,
there would be a very high rate of rotor wear.  That was OK; I just
wanted decent braking and enough durability to get through the event.
I was very skeptical--especially when I found that these pads would
cost $190 a set.

I picked up the Hawk pads from Art a few days before the event, and I
installed them just before leaving home for the 100 mile drive to the
Glen. On the way down, we detoured onto some deserted rural roads and
spent some time (about 30 minutes) doing the recommended series of
bedding-in runs. Oh, what a smell! We proceeded to Watkins Glen. This
was to be a fairly severe test of brake durability, and I kept asking
Art for assurance that replacement pads and rotors would be available
during the event. The previous year I had carried a spare set of pads
but hadn't been savvy enough to  install 'em before the first pads
wore through to nothing and trashed the rotors (with no spare rotors

Marc was in the novice group and I was intermediate. The brakes
rarely had much time for cooloing. We quickly began to feel somewhat
like ALMS drivers <g>! But to make a long story short--this time the
car (with Hoppen chip, BTW) and brakes performed flawlessly!
Definitely there was a better "feel" (quick grip and fade resistance)
than ever before. The pads and rotors lasted easily--in spite of
doing double duty--through the entire event. But the real eye-opener
was when I was back home--removing the Hawk pads and reinstalling the
oem pads. The Hawk Blue pads could hardly be told from new! They had
done double-duty at the Glen, yet at least 90% of the original pad
thickness remained!!! The rotors' appearance and thickness were very
moderately affected--a slight amount of additional grooving compared
to the starting surface (which was very smooth).

Marc drove pretty hard for a novice I think, while I drove the car at
least as hard as he did. Neither of us made any special effort to "go
easy" on the brakes. And neither of us actually had any complaints
about the adequacy of the G60 brakes with those pads. Could it have
been a lot better with more braking (from Big Reds and larger
rotors)? Sure. There is no doubt in my mind that a "real" brake
upgrade would do a better job and be more-suited to an advanced
driver. But I think that using good competition pads like the 9012
Hawks with the G60 brakes makes the the G60--for a lot of
people--suitable for track use. The cost of those pads--and of course
limiting their use to track events--is a small price to pay
considering the improved braking and the astounding low wear. From my
experience, this is a good way (not the ultimate way) to make G60
brakes--and even oem rotors--a useful setup for the '91 200q on the

Am I still seriously considering a _real_ upgrade to the G60s? Definitely.


>True- although I have never been able to engage the ABS at 100mph
>really tried, though, although I've come close). I can engage the ABS at
>50mph with the UFOs.
>What you gain is pedal feel, much cheaper rotor replacement, much better
>for track use.
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Mike Miller [mailto:MikeMilr at blackfoot.net]
>Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2002 2:51 AM
>To: TM; BIRA Brake List; 200q20v at audifans.com
>Subject: Re: [200q20v] Upgraded Brakes
>Seems to me that if you could engage ABS at 100 mph before and after you
>havent really gained too much in everyday driveability. Of course, you
>have likely gained a bunch in terms of repeated brakeability without
>fade. But, that deer I see in the road doesn't wait for my UFO's to stop
>multiple times.
>mike miller
>helmville mt
>200q20v mailing list
>200q20v at audifans.com


Phil Rose				Rochester, NY
'91 200q	(130 Kmiles, Lago blue)
'91 200q   (57 Kmiles, Tornado red)
	mailto:pjrose at frontiernet.net

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