Relays and Euro lights
malth at umich.edu
Tue Jun 4 10:50:24 EDT 2002
But Bernie, pin configuration aside, you're missing an important factor -
weather - when you're saying certain in-hood relays work fine for you in
your dry, (warm?), non-salted-road, Western climate (of course they
would!) and that they should for Scott as well in his cold, wet,
road-salted Chicago climate.
You have more margin for error from Mother Nature, where Scott doesn't. I
think weather has more to do with it than the amount of pins in the
On Tue, 4 Jun 2002, Bernie Benz wrote:
> Welcome back, Scott. Good to hear from you.
> Sounds like you need to use better relays, or move from Chicago. A 4 pin
> relay is not the best choice for this high current, two relay application,
> IMO. Bosch and PB make a 5 pin cube relay specifically for this type app.
> in which there is a common input to two sets of 30A NO contacts and dual
> outputs, thus dividing the current between two sets of contacts and output
> terminals. This has great wiring advantages in that only one #12 wire need
> go into each socket connector. In your enviroment maybe the relay cover
> needs to be replaced with a little silicone caulk.
> In my 44s I've had my dual relays mounted on the frame member just behind
> the pass headlight, near where the jump post used to be (it's now airborne).
> No heat, no corrosion, no fuses, no problems, and wiring runs are as short
> as possible. In the 89 chassis they are mounted on top of the pass strut
> > From: QSHIPQ at aol.com
> > Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2002 08:34:00 EDT
> > To: b.m.benz at prodigy.net, brianl at starsys.com
> > Cc: 200q20v at audifans.com, urq at audifans.com
> > Subject: Re: Relays and Euro lights
> > --
> > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ]
> > Just read this one.... The case of "new" spec vs element exposed reality.
> > The problem with relays is they have a life, specifically, they have a half
> > life. The harsher the environment they operate in, the shorter the half
> > life. In the case of my "underhood" installed relays in my urq for instance,
> > the crap wiring job from alt to relays located them right beside the radiator
> > (heat and water/salt). Which reduced the half life of my relays to less than
> > two months. When these pups get hot and/or wet, there is no guarantee of
> > spec. In fact, in my case '83 urq, the relays would randomly arc closed,
> > this is *with* a 30 amp inline fuse (then run the battery down). This
> > wouldn't happen if it was sunny, pretty much a guarantee if it was
> > raining/snowing (after shut down the lights would either stay on, or the heat
> > buildup would turn them on in the middle of the night)
> > I put up with this for 4 changes of relays in 6 months, until I recently
> > moved and properly mounted them in the glovebox area, and strung 10/12guage
> > wire from the battery. Nary a problem since. The problem with applying
> > 200amps relays is a couple fold. IF your relays are marginal (not new) you
> > DO risk the chance of not only arcing them, but welding them closed AND
> > blowing the bulbs out. I'm only sharing BTDT. I assure you Bernie, I have
> > and understand the operating specifications of *new* 12v 4pin relays.
> > I'm only sharing what I see in practice, and personal experience. If you
> > routinely replace your relays *before* failure, your theory/specification
> > applies. IME, few routinely replace relays before failure. In the land of
> > winter salt, underhood relays fail quite regularly, so do those high amp
> > unprotected connections between relay and wiring. Mounting them near the
> > battery post means you put them near the hottest heat generator too (turbo),
> > which means half life ain't great.
> > "Don't fix if it ain't broke" - ok, but when it does, "Fix it right the first
> > time" (?)
> > My .02
> > Scott Justusson
> > practical relay install specialist
> > In a message dated 5/31/02 3:20:11 PM Central Daylight Time,
> > b.m.benz at prodigy.net writes:
> > Do you normally jump start your car with the headlites on? 200 amps will
> > flow through a discharged battery with an applied voltage at the jump
> > terminal of less than, or very little more than the normal system opperating
> > voltage, and rapid chargers are voltage regulated, restricting the peak
> > applied voltage to about 15 volts. They are designed to be idiot proof!
> > Further, the arc over voltage of an open relay is well in excess of 600
> > volts.
> > Bernie
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