[s-cars] More on audi wheel bolts/studs/torque
QSHIPQ at aol.com
QSHIPQ at aol.com
Mon Oct 21 14:01:58 EDT 2002
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I'm one of the ones that said NO! Robert. IME with antiseize, it can only
compound, not alleviate anything wrt torquing wheels. A bolt torque (unless
otherwise specified - IE head bolts for instance) are "dry" specification.
ANY use of a lubricant on wheel bolts will change that torque specification.
To what? I have no idea. But I have seen wheels with A/S on them get loose.
YMMV? It could, but contrary to your experience, my customers using it
hasn't been so good with A/S.
I really see no need for A/S, it's name means exactly what it's designed to
do. In the case of a wheel bolt or nut, a clean thread should and will
provide a good clamping force on a hub. If A/S were a recommended Audi
procedure, you'd see it in a TSB somewhere (Stabilant-22 is mentioned, A/S
isn't anywhere that I can find), or on wheels from the factory, or addressed
somewhere OEM or aftermarket. I have never seen it. As a shop guy, I'd
never put A/S on bolts, cuz there is NO documentation to support it's use,
nor is it a standard and routine Audi/any marque procedure. Audi has several
references to loctite on parts that it's used as a sealant, not a "locking"
compound per sae.
As a race car/crew guy, I'd never use it, nor have I *ever* seen it. With
proper torquing of clean threaded wheel nuts/bolts/hub, there is NO need for
it. Most folks start using it after standing on a foot breaker bar to loosen
bolts. That's not an A/S problem, that's a corrosion problem that all
aluminum wheel cars with steel hubs and wheel bolts (+ infrequent wheel
change intervals) are famous for. If you remove a wheel bolt, and it's
corroded, it either should be replaced, or minimally cleaned. The hub can be
cleaned with a wire brush in minutes, so can the mating surface of a wheel.
When this subject came up on the qlist years ago, several indicated "success"
with using A/S. I personally avoid it like the plague, and have never
stripped a wheel bolt or nut from "not" using it, and use a common and
recommended cleaning procdure only with the same success (er my *1* exception
Robert, you are adding another component to the heat cycle and dry torque
clamping forces. This torque wrench procedure IMO, has nothing to do with
"coating" bolt/stud threads, it has everything to do with heat cycles, wheel
change frequency, torque and the relationship between them. I just don't see
how A/S is going to *help* anything, you've only changed to an unknown wet
My dry torque on the subject.
In a message dated 10/21/2002 11:16:36 AM Central Daylight Time,
robert at s-cars.org writes:
Would it be possible for you to evaluate whether or not antiseize might
alleviate the loss of torque problem.
Here's my story: I have done a number of wheel changes at the change of
season when I replace winter tires/wheels with summer tires/wheel. In
every instance, after driving the car for a few miles, I found that the
wheel bolts needed retorqueing. I finally applied some copper containing
antiseize to the bolts and since then have never had to retorque after a
wheel change over.
I have heard all sorts of statements relating to "NEVER use antiseize on
wheel bolts!" IME, I've been satisfied with the results. Would this be
worth a try for your car? At worst you will need to clean off some grease
from the bolts and their mating parts. At best your problem might be
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