Road Grooves Kill ME!

Martin, Gary G MartinGG at
Mon Apr 14 19:34:51 EDT 2003

I agree. I put my UrS4 wheels on the 200 and it was noticeably more
darty..if that is a word. Also, I agree that tires can make a big
difference. Going from Nittos to Firestone SZ50 on the UrS4...big
difference. But I also noticed a lot less sway by replacing just the sway
bar bushings at about 110k miles.


-----Original Message-----
From: Derek Pulvino [mailto:dbpulvino at]
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2003 4:00 PM
To: 200q20v at
Subject: RE: Road Grooves Kill ME!

As someone who's been down this road, my experience has shown that a change
in tires had the most positive impact on the cars tracking.  I had replaced
the front subframe, inner control arm, and all sway bar bushings, tie-rod
ends, and shocks/struts, and then had numerous alignments done (about 3-4).

Having a good alignment did make a difference, but I remember being a bit
put off by the change in performance/driving characteristics after the above
listed work was completed; the time I spent wrenching didn't seem to justify
the benefit I saw on the other side.

When I recently had some new tires put on my car, the difference was very
pronounced.  This positive benefit may not have been obtainable without
having first replaced the above listed parts, but pure hypothesis.  Further,
and of course this is my experience only, running a bigger tire on the car
(URS4 5-star w/40mm offest and 16x8 wheel, 225-50-16), made the car, in my
opinion, drive like shit.  Upon going back to the stock 215-60-15 w/35mm (I
think) offest car drove much better, and I didn't perceive any loss in
handling prowess.  In fact, as I'd stated before, I actually did better in
an autocross (based on relative placement within the days running times)
with the stock size wheel as opposed to the URS4 wheel.  I know there are a
couple of variable here, but I think biggest change was a result of

Just one mans opinion without benefit of the time or money to
"scientifically study" the phenomenom.  Make of it what you will.

Derek P

I was very surprised, pleasently at that.

Derek P

Message: 8
From: "Martin, Gary G" <MartinGG at>
To: 200q20v <200q20v at>
Subject: RE: Road Grooves Kill ME!
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 20:23:51 -0400

If it were me, I would replace all the sway bar bushings (6) and maybe the
inner control arm bushings (2). Even if this doesn't solve the problem, it
will help with the handling. After that, get the 4 wheel alignment. I also
replaced the sub frame bushings at about that mileage but the improvement,
if any, was subtle. HTH


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