[s-cars] Re: [urq] AutoFrost?
robert at s-cars.org
Tue Jun 24 06:42:21 EDT 2003
[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ]
Forgive me, Calvin, but the statement, "R134a is more flammable than
duracool", is absurd.
R134a is 1,1,1,2-tetrafluoroethane. R12 is dichlorodifluoromethane. Both
of these compounds are quite similar to the precursor of Teflon. Because
R134a has two remaining hydrogens it can be burned at high temperatures or
if it is mixed into an oxygen enriched atmosphere. It can in no way be
considered "flammable" in any ordinary sense. "Can be burned" differs
greatly from being "flammable".
Duracool is a mixture of hydrocarbons for crying out loud. Chief among the
components of this mixture is (from the Duracool MSDS statement) are butane
(15-40% v/v - deceptively named methyl ethyl methane), isobutane (30-60%
v/v - called by its less frequently used but correct scientific name,
2-methylpropane), and propane (40-70% v/v - again deceptively named
dimethylmethane). These mixtures would serve quite nicely as fuel for your
pocket lighter. They are extremely flammable (in the ordinary sense).
Any claim that "R134a is more flammable than duracool" can only come from
Duracool advertising - very deceptive and misleading advertising, as
deceptive as the names they are calling butane, isobutane, and propane.
At 11:18 PM 6/23/2003 -0600, Calvin & Diana Craig wrote:
>R134a is more flammable than duracool.
>From: s-car-list-admin at audifans.com
>[mailto:s-car-list-admin at audifans.com]On Behalf Of Robert Myers
>Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 4:08 AM
>To: Mark Strangways; Calvin & Diana Craig; Bill Bennett; Greg Johnson;
>northwest audi enthusiasts; S Cars; V8; urq; 200 List
>Subject: Re: [s-cars] Re: [urq] AutoFrost?
>[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ]
>True under prolonged high heat in the presence of quite a lot of oxygen R12
>can be converted (in VERY small amounts) into a phosgene-like
>chemical. R12 will not "burn" in the ordinary sense one sees when
>combustion occurs. The heat must come from something else which is
>burning, not from combustion of the R12 itself. The process is a slow
>process. If you are in a situation where any significant amount (enough to
>cause you health problems through acute exposure) will be formed through
>conversion of R12 you are likely already dead from your burns. A trace of
>phosgene is certainly far less of a hazard than a face full of flames from
>burning refrigerant or burning gasoline.
>My recommendation: Use the R134a originally used in your car or convert
>your R12 car to use R134a or properly maintain your R12 car so that leaks
>are forestalled by preventive maintenance. Use of flammable refrigerant
>when non-flammable ones are available is, IMO, simply foolish and a false
>At 11:26 PM 6/22/2003 -0400, Mark Strangways wrote:
> >One thing to add here.
> >I know R-12 forms a deadly poison gas when it comes into contact with open
> >So, turn the A/C off prior to getting into that multicar accident !
>---GBS (great big snip)---
>Preserve our wildlife - throw a party tonight.
> Robert L. Myers 304-574-2372
> Rt. 4, Box 57, Fayetteville, WV 25840 USA WV tag Q SHIP
> '95 urS6 Cashmere Grey - der Wunderwagen ICQ 22170244
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Robert L. Myers 304-574-2372
Rt. 4, Box 57, Fayetteville, WV 25840 USA WV tag Q SHIP
'95 urS6 Cashmere Grey - der Wunderwagen ICQ 22170244
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