fwd: wheel step out during hard 1st or reverse turns

QSHIPQ at aol.com QSHIPQ at aol.com
Sat Dec 7 11:34:07 EST 2002


Delivered-To: s-car-list at audifans.com
From: QSHIPQ at aol.com
To: vfregeac at sympatico.ca, rpastore at animalfeeds.com, dburig at igsenergy.com,
    paul.heneghan at bbc.co.uk, s-car-list at audifans.com
Cc: bob.rossato at att.net, igor at s-cars.org, torsen at audifans.com
Subject: [s-cars] Re:wheel step out during hard 1st or reverse turns
Sender: s-car-list-admin at audifans.com
Precedence: bulk
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 09:53:41 EST

[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ]
I'll put forth in more detail what I think is going on, and what's happening
(no teddy I don't by Ackermann Effect, too much rubber in the suspension). =
believe this happens in ALL quattro and non quattro transmissions.  I singl=
out the torsen for the S car, cuz it "should" be allocating less torque, so
it should happen less than the others.

Try taking your car, putting in on a jack, and turn the wheels to full lock,
try rotating one of the wheels, what happens?  IMshop, what happens is you
see popping from the outer CV joint that is trying to accomodate rotation
with extreme angle.  When you think of this applying torque to it (and a lot
of it in first and reverse gear maneuvers), it's going to jamb up even more.
When it's cold, even more.  Occasionally, what you find is that this pop
causes the front wheel to step out.  IME, it's usually more on the right si=
than the left, a carryover to the old open diff theory regarding orientation
of the ring and pinion vs primary drive wheel.    On a torsen car, this
should happen less because the torque allocation *should* be less to the
front as you turn.  I suspect it's not less for a couple reasons, oil
viscosity when cold, high torque, and extreme driveshaft differentiation.  =
it's just with ANY applied torque (or just motion itself) to the outer cv at
extreme angles, it's going to pop and cause step out.

Concerning?  I sure wouldn't be.  I'd sure avoid full lock hard gas first or
reverse maneuvers, but I'd do that anyway, cuz that's a good way to break
open your spider basket as well, slamming helix gears to the maximum can
break them.

Long nerdy, and HTH


vfregeac at sympatico.ca writes:

I second this opinion. I've experienced the same behaviour on a friend's
FWD car with huge tire width (Don't remember the size, too long ago; I
don't even know if I knew at this time what tire sizes mean). Anyway, if
a FWD can do this, Torsen is not the culprit.


-----Message d'origine-----
De : s-car-list-admin at audifans.com
[mailto:s-car-list-admin at audifans.com] De la part de Robert Pastore
Envoy=E9 : 5 d=E9cembre 2002 09:51
=C0 : 'QSHIPQ at aol.com'; Robert Pastore; dburig at igsenergy.com;
paul.heneghan at bbc.co.uk; s-car-list at audifans.com
Cc : bob.rossato at att.net; igor at s-cars.org
Objet : RE: [s-cars] Suspension bushings and tranny mounts

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[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ]

The torsen was my first suspect, but the noise sounds as if it is coming
from the wheel, not the center fo the car.   Yesterday, someone posted
cold tires, and I'm now thinking he might have been right.   When I left
office last night, I easily replicated the sound.   I tried again
the parts store ( buying Audi parts, of course), and could not replicate
for my buddy there, nor could it replicate the sound when I reached
It might just be cold tires.


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