Japanese vs. Audi (was: coilpacks)

TM t44tq at mindspring.com
Tue Jan 28 12:10:19 EST 2003

That's where I disagree about build quality. Taking new cars as
a discussion point, I think that, dollar for dollar, the cars currently
produced by Nissan, Mazda and Subaru, for example, are quite good.

We can pretty much forget about the sub-$30k market if you're comparing
against Audi, so you're into the Infiniti G35, I35, Lexus ES300

As much as I really dislike Lexus cars for their extreme isolation from
driving feel, they are excellent cars- very high build quality,
safety ratings, reliability unparalleled by Audi. If I was only
in a car for transporation and not for the driving experience, I'd
look at a Lexus ES300 or IS300. However, they are very bland cars and
drive like an Audi or BMW, so I have little interest in them.

I think the Infiniti G35 is a superior driver's car to the Audi A4 or
BMW 3 series if you take into account price. Excellent brakes, excellent
feel, lots of power, nice seats. The biggest downside is the interior-
I'm not
crazy about the aluminum-look execution as well as the amber
and some will call the styling downright ugly.

The A4, in comparison, is downright slow, has significantly less road
and the brakes are no anywhere near the same class of performance and
costs quite a bit more, weighs a lot more and has a really crappy dealer

The BMW 330i/xi is similar in performance but the costs are so much
higher that
they're not really in the same price class, big downside to the BMW. At
in the Philly area, there are some truly excellent BMW dealers, so I'd
lean to
BMW over Audi in that regard.


-----Original Message-----
From: Wylie Bean [mailto:TheRingmeister at triad.rr.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2003 7:38 AM
To: TM; quattro at audifans.com; willng at netzero.net
Subject: Re: coilpacks

It doesn't take an engineer (i'm not one) to look over an Audi next to a
Nissan and see the differences in design, construction, and build
quality. I didn't say they built a truly substandard product as such, I
stated that by comparison, I believe that by no means is the level of
any of the above elements comparable to an Audi (or a BMW or Mercedes
for that matter.) Quite simply, you get what you pay for.  By "paper
mache" I was referring to
the chassis and gauge of sheetmetal used to build it.   Otherwise,
maybe the short list.  Four link suspension, quattro, seatbelt
pre-tensioners and force limiters, bumper (not the plastic cover)
construction/engineering, crumple zones and a 12 year warranty against
corrosion that keeps them functioning much longer than any Nissan or
Infinity's, the chassis itself (torsional rigidity, full double sided
galvanized sheetmetal and a parafin wax dip to extricate water from the
body cavity), aluminum hoods, eletronic brake force distribution and
hydraulic brake assist, 5 valve technology, FSI, ASF, 6 standard airbags
including full side curtains (except TTs of course), interior materials
such as headliner, switches, covers, carpet, knobs, you name it.  I'd
rather have a used Audi anyday than a new Nissan or Infinity (or Toyota
or Mazda or Lexus) for the same $.  Period.  It's just a safer, better
designed, better executed vehicle.

Obviously, this is my opinion, and I appreciate you asking.

----- Original Message -----
From: "TM" <t44tq at mindspring.com>
To: "'Wylie Bean'" <TheRingmeister at triad.rr.com>;
<quattro at audifans.com>; <willng at netzero.net>
Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 9:03 PM
Subject: RE: coilpacks

> Wylie-
> Since you've said what you've said, please give some examples of where

> Nissan has made some truly substandard construction.
> Taka
> -----Original Message-----
> From: quattro-admin at audifans.com [mailto:quattro-admin at audifans.com]
> On Behalf Of Wylie Bean
> Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 1:52 AM
> To: quattro at audifans.com; willng at netzero.net
> Subject: Re: coilpacks
> Wait a minute, you're comparing something that was a poor design to
> begin with (passive safety belts) with something that is a design
> superior to anything as such but has a definite useful life expectancy

> (which Audi has extended to 15 years by the way, and not because
> they're responsible for paying for fixing it, either).  Give me a
> (expletive
> deleted) break.  By the way, I'd rather "say a little prayer" (which
> I've never really thought about even having to do) when I start my
> than having to be in constant connection with the man upstairs any
> second I was riding in a paper-mache' constructed Nissan variant.
> a good thing they've actually got Audi out there to attempt to copy.
> Who knows what they might be marketing otherwise. You've obviously
> had a seriously close look at the way the cars are constructed,
> wrenching on them or not.
> A. Wylie Bean
> Audi Brand Specialist
> Flow Motors, LLC
> 425 Silas Creek Parkway
> Winston-Salem NC 27127
> 1-800-489-3534
> TheRingmeister at triad.rr.com
> abean at flowauto.com

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