Subject: Re: [urq] '83 UrQuattro - Now CIS Potential

J. Lyons raudi1 at
Thu Jun 19 20:32:38 EDT 2003

>Hello all,
    I have seen the max MC motor hp #'s with CIS on the list since I
started subscribing. I always believed Javads #'s below to be fairly

However, based on a conversation I had with Ken Bennett (of 2Bennett
Audi) just last week,  he was mentioning being able to get 280-300 out
of the MC motor with stock CIS injection?!

Now we did not discuss all the particulars involved (other than bigger
downpipe & exhaust, bigger turbo, and a cam) but the conversation came
about when I mentioned wanting a smog legal EFI (or the name of a smog
shop that will pass the visual portion with 034EFI in place) to start
searching for more power.

Kinda makes me wonder now whats possible.

J. Lyons
84 CGT turbo
86 4KCSQ
79 5KS

>From: JShadzi at
>Subject: Re: [urq] '83 UrQuattro - Now CIS Potential
>Ben, I'll have to agree with John, and I think I've told you this before as=
> well, there is no easy hp above about 225 with any of the Audi CIS systems=
>, everything is against it including the CIS fuel capacity, the CIS airflow=
> capacity and the factory exh. manifold restriction.  250-300 is much easie=
>r with EFI, but even then the IC, exh. manfiold and turbo selection will be=
> critical, EFI will give the airflow potential and fuel accurately, but EFI=
> won't flow air efficiently like the right combo of turbo, IC and induction=
>/exhaust can.
>With 15psi I ran 230hp at the wheels in my 80tq, I'm hitting the dyno next =
>week to do another baseline with 15psi running the new 034efi Stage II syst=
>em with programmable distributor ignition.  The car has never run better or=
> faster, I'm estimating that I'm making at least 10% more power to the whee=
>ls (at the same 15psi) due to the ignition tuning alone, but the dyno will =
>only tell.
>Like John says, with CIS the most you can hope for is to tune it to about 1=
>.8Bar and live happily with it,anything more will just piss it off and rend=
>er little results.  There has also been a lot of BS out there about swappin=
>g in this Mercedes distributor and that Porsche injector, I don't buy it ca=
>use I tried it myself (pre-EFI development) and have yet to see anyone else=
> implement it successfully.  The CIS system works VERY well in the stock ap=
>plication and in slightly boosted applications, but its not a high performa=
>nce fuel system and its extremely limited as is the whole 10v system  (excl=
>uding the motor itself) in stock trim.
>I'm a big fan of the 10v, but in order to make 20v power (which it will) it=
> needs to be in a similar level of trim, and then the power starts coming "=
>>If anyone has the "holy grail" of MC, non-EFI power and can prove it,
>>please let me know!

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