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Re: Reverse lights
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- Subject: Re: Reverse lights
- From: Dave Eaton <firstname.lastname@example.org>
- Date: Sat, 09 May 1998 08:32:05 +1200
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well, i'll see if i can say it more simply.
we have a list member (jouko) who has talked to one of audi's rally drivers who
told him that the torsen was used in the s1. now jouko is probably not as
reliable a witness as you scott, but, for me at least, he'll do...
once again, the sport was homologated in 1983 (with open centre diff). the
torsen wasn't available to audi then, and didn't make to audi vehicles until
4-5 years afterwards. so the sport never used it. it wasn't allowed to, until
the evolution model (available under the group "b" rules) was developed and
raced. the evolution model (20 examples allowed, no homologation) allowed much
greater latitude under the rules. hence the space frame, the aerodynamics and
the group "a" cars were (most likley) homologated (25,000 required) with the
torsen, and so would have been rally'ed with them (in whatever guise). i don't
have the homologation dates for the group "a" cars though...
not sure how i can make this more clear.
>Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 10:13:46 EDT
>From: QSHIPQ <QSHIPQ@aol.com>
>>the s1 was last used to the group 'b' rules in 1985. we know that audi
>>rally'ed with the s1/torsen at least at the san remo, as they'd be able to
>>homologate the torsen with the "evolution" (20-off) provision of the group
>>rules (sport quatro --> s1 (evo)).
>Where is the documentation of Torsen use? Do we really know that, or are you
>taking the homog to mean that torsens were used. Not a jump I would make.
>Audi would never cheat, no way, never. Even if the drivers wanted nothing to
>do with the Torsen. Hey, rules is rules.
>>the other rally's were undertaken to the group "a" rules where audi, unless
>>they were cheating, *had* to use the torsen on the cars homologated (25,000
>>examples) with them.
>>therefore we can safely say that the torsen was on all these 1986 group 'a'
>>cars, unless audi was cheating.
>>over to you, scott.
>I'm smiling Dave, you are exactly right in your "thinking". 'Cept ALL street
>sport quattros produced under homog had NO torsens (all lockers f&r). So audi
>would technically be cheating if they USED torsens. You have this backwards
>And we know that no one would think of cheating in any race environment.
>>the evoluton model, the s1, the drivers liked a *lot* more. it had a number
>of tweaks, notably aerodynamics and weight re-distribution that improved it
>>considerably. it could now take the jumps that the sport couldn't. it is
>>now also apparent that the s1 also had the option of the torsen.
>>this is from the conversation i had with walter rohrl.
>Did you ask if WR ran it? Wonder how fast the audi boys could change a torsen
>out, given that spring that sits in the 6speed trans. Betcha it's quick.
>Wonder how many times that quickness was tested?
>Couple more questions you may want to ask WR:
>Why was his only Rally win in ANY quattro since June of 1983, San Remo of Oct
>1985? Nothing in between and nothing after? Torsen?
>Ok. Then what happend at RAC in Nov of 1985? Retired: Rohrl: Went off
>Torsen? Geez, given his prowess of the past 5years, the Went Off sure doesn't
>sound like a WR characteristic
>What can fool a torsen?
>Interesting information Dave. Rather incomplete though
the sport quattro in rally guise was a pig. it was homologated and raced with
the open (lockable) centre. it won nothing, and certainly not the hearts and
minds of its pilots. sure you want to go here scott?
are you seriously suggesting that it would take any longer to change a torsen
than a locker? ever looked under the car? the transmission casing is the same
either way as far as i can see. fiche for the sport says so. guess that the
fiche isn't as reliable as you though.
mmm, a rally driver going off is supposed to be a rare experience? maybe i
should tell tommi, or carlos, or juha.
feet on the ground scott, you're reaching...